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hitmanNo2

GHK M4 GBBR - available after Chinese New Year

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So GHK has an M4 coming out.  We've seen a few photos here and there but not much info has been released. Supposedly will be available after the Chinese new year.  If it's as good as the G5, it should be pretty sweet.

 

It looks to have the bolt catch attached like the RS AR15s and new Vipers which is interesting.

 

A few sample photos on their Facebook page.

 

https://www.facebook.com/pages/GHK-airsoft/294289027379552

 

 

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Looks like a modified WA. I specially like the new design for the valve knocker, much more massive.

 

The fact that they've given up on the whole valve knocker and bolt stop block thingie also pleases me.

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YES! It might seem really strange to get excited about another AR model, but I've been wanting this for ages, after the G5 and the AK series, I pretty much concluded that so far GHK is the company that makes the best GBBs in terms of performance against cool down, YES YES YES, wonder what the externals would be based on, it'd be nice if it can take loads of RS parts... 

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I've got the GHK PDW myself and if they make their M4 at least as great as the PDW, it will be sort of an instant buy. Can't wait for it :D

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It'll still flop in anything less than 10c, like every other super mega efficient GBBR to be released lately... 

 

I should also explain I'm not at all hating on the thing - I'm quite excited to see what it's like, as it's based heavily on the WA system and the new mags should fit existing WA designs, which can't be a bad thing at all - I'm a big fan of GHK mags.

 

I just feel like it's worth pointing out that this won't really do significantly better than any other AR15 GIM gun; the GHK G5 works so well due to the small bolt and short travel, and the AK has a gas reservoir the size of a small lake. With any AR, no matter how efficient the mag is, if it runs on propane or GG it's not going to be much use in genuinely cold weather without Co2.

 

I'm still eagerly anticipating the release though, even if it is just for the mags and potentially the hop system.

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So GHK has an M4 coming out.  We've seen a few photos here and there but not much info has been released. Supposedly will be available after the Chinese new year.  If it's as good as the G5, it should be pretty sweet.

 

It looks to have the bolt catch attached like the RS AR15s and new Vipers which is interesting.

 

A few sample photos on their Facebook page.

 

https://www.facebook.com/pages/GHK-airsoft/294289027379552

Good timing on this as the upcoming KWA Mega-Arms release isn't doing it for me, no matter how hard I try.  

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It'll still flop in anything less than 10c, like every other super mega efficient GBBR to be released lately... 

 

I should also explain I'm not at all hating on the thing - I'm quite excited to see what it's like, as it's based heavily on the WA system and the new mags should fit existing WA designs, which can't be a bad thing at all - I'm a big fan of GHK mags.

 

I just feel like it's worth pointing out that this won't really do significantly better than any other AR15 GIM gun; the GHK G5 works so well due to the small bolt and short travel, and the AK has a gas reservoir the size of a small lake. With any AR, no matter how efficient the mag is, if it runs on propane or GG it's not going to be much use in genuinely cold weather without Co2.

 

I'm still eagerly anticipating the release though, even if it is just for the mags and potentially the hop system.

 

Oh, just wait. The G5 has a very interesting mag technology, it's not just the SMG-like design.

 

I mean, even a WE 1911 is more efficient/reliable than the strictly WA-based platforms, so the bar's not set very high from the get-go. I can see how it can be difficult to accept when the people running these systems have dumped thousands of dollars in parts and mags (me included, luckily got rid of my WOC - wait, not really, still trying to get it to work for the guy I sold it to).

 

I'm just saying GHK really came through with their G5 and apparently with their newer AK line as well, I doubt they'll just go back to a primitive design for their M4s.

 

 

Fox

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Yeah it's true, however I did see someone on the field with a G5 few weeks back, where my TM XDM was barely working, and he seemed to be doing fine, so I'm optimistic, not to mention there will be CO2 mags :D Rumor has it that they're working on a new AK COmag, so I can only hope they're developing new CO2 mags that are better than their old ones (I have no idea how good / bad they were, but considering they were developed for the WA system, perhaps there can be further optimisation with their new system) 

 

Here are the words from GHK's Facebook message regarding the mags and low temperature on 10th of Dec, don't think anyone translated it so here it is:

 

"low temperature is the GBB killer"

 

Anyone with the G5 has probably experienced using the gun in the cold (around 10c)

Whether it's semi auto or full auto, you'd be able to empty the magazine in one go.

with no obvious "weak shots", the gas efficiency of G5 is well known. 

 

We had improved the gas system two years ago in the early development of the G5.

Initially we were using the GHK PDW as a testing platform for a gas efficient system,

However after the 31st shot, the efficiency curves downwards,

we figured developing a brand new gas system (instead of improving on the PDW) was the way to go,

after 2 years of endless testing, plus a bit of passion (?)

we have today's G5.

 

Perhaps not known by everyone, but the M4's "base" isn't very ideal.

In order to achieve GHK's standard, we had many technical problems to overcome.

Thus we have continued to delay the development of an M4 protect.

It wasn't until we have successfully used the G5 as a proof of concept, before we could start to deveop the M4.

 

The development of the M4 wasn't a smooth ride.

Even we have the G5 to base on, the two have different specifications and dimensions.

In the early stages of the GHK-M4 development, even though we could empty a 40 round magazine in one go at around 18c,

we hit another bottleneck after the 31st shot at 10'c, after many more cycles of testing, our current M4 is born.

 

1480568_334632190011902_994547415_n.jpg

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Ha ha.  A WE 1911 mag more efficient than the WA system?  What drugs are you on?

 

Maybe I exaggerated a bit with the WE 1911s. But it's not a good system. No matter just how much money you got into yours. Let me guess, you also have a PTW and it's the bestest thing ev4r, right?

 

Being more serious, maybe yours works just OK. But I've had nothing but trouble with that system (you can look around the forum for my specific posts on this if you're curious) and I'm pretty experienced working on different GBBR platforms. But the mags are disasterpieces of engineering and manufacturing (to sum up previous posts, I had about 6 G&P PMAGs, they all were different in size, some I had to file to fit the receiver and some fit right away. All leaked at one point. They didn't work with a few after-market BCs. Cold weather and continous fire of the gun are undoable. I could go on and on).

 

 

Yeah it's true, however I did see someone on the field with a G5 few weeks back, where my TM XDM was barely working, and he seemed to be doing fine, so I'm optimistic, not to mention there will be CO2 mags :D Rumor has it that they're working on a new AK COmag, so I can only hope they're developing new CO2 mags that are better than their old ones (I have no idea how good / bad they were, but considering they were developed for the WA system, perhaps there can be further optimisation with their new system) 

 

 

Why so excited about CO2? I remember trying CO2 capsules vs. Green gas and only getting a poorer performance. Have you effectively run the same system under the same conditions with both CO2 after failing with GG?

 

 

Fox

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No.  No PTW for me.  Sure.  They are tricky to get going right.  But if you avoid straying too far into after market parts (assuming starting from a WOC base) and get the right mags, you should have minimal issues that aren't down to the inherent issues with GBBRs at least.

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Errm... not sure where to begin. COis a lot more resilient to cool down, so in case of GHK's gas efficient system, it might be the only GBB platform that has a chance under cold condition, and by cold I mean between 0-5c cold (something you probably won't have to worry in your climate), provided it has a good CO2 magazine. CO2's pressure "raw" is at about 700 psi at room temperature, where as green is around 120 psi.. sometimes a lot of work is required to get CO2 mags to work reliably, seldom do you get to just get a mag and expect it to perform straight away, however, it's scientifically pretty obvious why they perform better in the cold. To give you an idea, at 0 degree celsius, propane's pressure is around 65 psi, where as airsoft guns generally operate at around 120 psi, CO2 on the other hand, still has around 400 psi at 0 degree celsius, so if it's regulated well, or reinforced enough so that it isn't damaged by unregulated magazines, then even at lower temperature, it still has plenty of pressure left to operate the gun. 

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Errm... not sure where to begin. COis a lot more resilient to cool down, so in case of GHK's gas efficient system, it might be the only GBB platform that has a chance under cold condition, and by cold I mean between 0-5c cold (something you probably won't have to worry in your climate), provided it has a good CO2 magazine. CO2's pressure "raw" is at about 700 psi at room temperature, where as green is around 120 psi.. sometimes a lot of work is required to get CO2 mags to work reliably, seldom do you get to just get a mag and expect it to perform straight away, however, it's scientifically pretty obvious why they perform better in the cold. To give you an idea, at 0 degree celsius, propane's pressure is around 65 psi, where as airsoft guns generally operate at around 120 psi, CO2 on the other hand, still has around 400 psi at 0 degree celsius, so if it's regulated well, or reinforced enough so that it isn't damaged by unregulated magazines, then even at lower temperature, it still has plenty of pressure left to operate the gun. 

 

I'm just talking your regular gas in mag with the crappy 12gr capsule CO2 mags. I tried them, they sucked. When a gun's CO2, that's usually what people get sold as "outperforming in the cold". And the G5 should run OK at those temps on Green Gas taking into account the refrigerator tests they did with the mags and all.

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Oh, just wait. The G5 has a very interesting mag technology, it's not just the SMG-like design.

 

I mean, even a WE 1911 is more efficient/reliable than the strictly WA-based platforms, so the bar's not set very high from the get-go. I can see how it can be difficult to accept when the people running these systems have dumped thousands of dollars in parts and mags (me included, luckily got rid of my WOC - wait, not really, still trying to get it to work for the guy I sold it to).

 

I'm just saying GHK really came through with their G5 and apparently with their newer AK line as well, I doubt they'll just go back to a primitive design for their M4s.

 

 

Fox

Boo-hoo, you had a WOC with an off-spec receiver (we call that a lemon), the world hasn't ended. By the way, my stock out of the box WOC (not counting the hop system) runs like a train, just like my last one and the one before that did.

 

Moving on.

 

A WE 1911 mag is nowhere close to as efficient as a WA mag - Every G&P Pmag I've had (all 19 of them) has been leak free and has worked down to 12c. After 12c, It's a simple matter of finding some GHK Co2 mags and switching out for them instead - I've used my WOC in 4c with GHK Co2 mags without issue. They cycle the gun flawlessly in any English cold and give a decent performance.

 

The general point I'm getting at is that GHK, while they're a fantastic company with some very interesting designs and generally fantastic products do not have the power to adjust physics. Green Gas won't cycle a properly sized M4 BCG below 10c. No matter how well you design a mag, it's just not going to happen. KWA produced the LM4 and sold it as a marvel of efficiency full of *suitcase*-hot technology, and they put out a video of the LM4 chewing through a mag that showed a surface temperature of about 2c. So I bought one. 10c? Nope, it flat out refused to function.

 

To cut a long story short, don't expect GHK to perform miracles - Sure, they might make a more efficient mag that might handle a couple of degrees colder, but don't expect this gun to work in silly temperatures. It's not going to be a winter miracle, it's going to be a GIM M4 GBBR with the same flaws they all have, only perhaps slightly less pronounced. 

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Oh, just wait. The G5 has a very interesting mag technology, it's not just the SMG-like design.

 

I mean, even a WE 1911 is more efficient/reliable than the strictly WA-based platforms, so the bar's not set very high from the get-go. I can see how it can be difficult to accept when the people running these systems have dumped thousands of dollars in parts and mags (me included, luckily got rid of my WOC - wait, not really, still trying to get it to work for the guy I sold it to).

 

I'm just saying GHK really came through with their G5 and apparently with their newer AK line as well, I doubt they'll just go back to a primitive design for their M4s.

 

 

Fox

Boo-hoo, you had a WOC with an off-spec receiver (we call that a lemon), the world hasn't ended. By the way, my stock out of the box WOC (not counting the hop system) runs like a train, just like my last one and the one before that did.

 

Moving on.

 

A WE 1911 mag is nowhere close to as efficient as a WA mag - Every G&P Pmag I've had (all 19 of them) has been leak free and has worked down to 12c. After 12c, It's a simple matter of finding some GHK Co2 mags and switching out for them instead - I've used my WOC in 4c with GHK Co2 mags without issue. They cycle the gun flawlessly in any English cold and give a decent performance.

 

The general point I'm getting at is that GHK, while they're a fantastic company with some very interesting designs and generally fantastic products do not have the power to adjust physics. Green Gas won't cycle a properly sized M4 BCG below 10c. No matter how well you design a mag, it's just not going to happen. KWA produced the LM4 and sold it as a marvel of efficiency full of *suitcase*-hot technology, and they put out a video of the LM4 chewing through a mag that showed a surface temperature of about 2c. So I bought one. 10c? Nope, it flat out refused to function.

 

To cut a long story short, don't expect GHK to perform miracles - Sure, they might make a more efficient mag that might handle a couple of degrees colder, but don't expect this gun to work in silly temperatures. It's not going to be a winter miracle, it's going to be a GIM M4 GBBR with the same flaws they all have, only perhaps slightly less pronounced. 

 

 

6 mags aren't "a lemon". All 6 of the G&Ps had different measurements (each and every one of them)! It wasn't (just) the receiver.

 

But anyhow we'll see when the thing comes out, I'm thinking it's gonna be much more reliable OotB, as well as better performing than the other M4 platforms we currently have, and hopefully a bit cheaper (a WOC is a really expensive high end gun, even when it works, it's still a bit of a money hog).

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I Have 5 g&p p mags and all work perfectly, all are the same size and none leak, so don't know what your on about, maybe you got, as you said six lemons (hate that)

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Well, thats only a month later anyway, Not much of a big deal.

 

Now of course, they didn't say exactly "when" after Chinese new year though. So lets hope they mean sometime soon after and not several months.

 

Even though I have several WE based AR15 GBBRs, Im still interested in this if GHK has found a way to make it more efficient in the cold.

 

I dont expect miracles but with a lighter weight bolt perhaps, the amount of gas needed to operate the gun would probably be much less. Im not sure what it is exactly they were planning but that always seemed like the most logical way to improve efficiency to me.

 

Im thinking of their AKM specifically, because the GHK AKM bolt is fairly light weight. Very light as a matter of fact. And Im sure that plus the large gas resevoir is what makes their AKM work better.

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I kinda liked my WE M16a1 with CO2. Ran quite nice but no way id take her out if it werent mid-summer.

 

I'd imagine WA-based one could tweak or buy big into better then WE but WE was skirmishable out-of-the-box. Atleast with CO2. Only mod mine had was shortened rs recoil-spring. Not needed but fun.

 

Ive given up on "recoil" in any form. I have rare fully working beefed up tremors-kit for AEGs and im now hoping to build "hoseless" HPA-setup via fusion engine and redline stock. Tremors kicks like a mule but needs LOTS of tweaks and kicks the wrong way. GBBRs have way too much issues for me. Sold that WE for a good price so i dont feel bad having it while i did.

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