FireKnife Posted May 23, 2011 Report Share Posted May 23, 2011 I think that considering the way they came about the P99 (and to those that noticed the P5, not PPK, Bond had in Octopussy ) they will just change the gun when Walther want a new one out on the market and need some publicity. But saying that in Quantum of Solace Bond ended up firing off a P226 for a bit and that seemed to suit so why not perhaps a P228/9 or P239? However is it me or does Bond ever reload his Walther or does he just have the one magazine? Though that may be answered by Hollywood fiction and the fact guns rarely need to reload. 'FireKnife' Link to post Share on other sites
frogfish Posted May 23, 2011 Report Share Posted May 23, 2011 Given that James Bond almost lost his life in one of the books because his .25 didn't have enough oomph.... I'm not talking about the books, I'm talking about the movies. Do you think the average movie goer knows the difference between a P22 and a P99 let alone a P99 and a P226? Do you think the average director knows the difference? Link to post Share on other sites
Jagdraben Posted May 23, 2011 Report Share Posted May 23, 2011 Isn't that self-evident from the fact that Hollywood doesn't issue everyone the exact same weapons for every movie with the same armory/prop shop? Producers, directors, actors, and prop shops all put a lot of thought into the guns that are used on set. They want their presence to be realistic and/or to "say something about the character" and/or be completely over-the-top (when applicable). Examples: Dirty Harry's model 29, Josie Wales's Colt Walkers, Dan and Will Evans's Colt Navy Conversions/Ben Wade's model P/Charlie Prince's Schofields, Everett Hitch's 1872 Open Top, The Agents' Desert Eagles (and just about every appearance of the infamous 'Deagle' in the history of ever), every appearance of the S&W X-frame revolvers to date (Machete, RED, that movie with Jason Statham), Hans Gruber's P7, the Joker's full-auto converted "stainless" Glock 17 (fantastic choice for the character), &c., &c., &c. Link to post Share on other sites
frogfish Posted May 23, 2011 Report Share Posted May 23, 2011 I do agree that a lot of thought goes into the selection of the weapon, but I don't think it has to do with the brand or model number (the people using them may have no clue of what they are, despite the logo engraved on the thing), it has to do with appearance (present or perceived) or marketing (sometimes). I also like the fact that you select example weapons that are all built around the characters or where a specific weapon is written into the plot line, and those examples are certainly not the standard. If an average director had a script that called for a big city SWAT sniper to shoot something, would he say fetch the M700, or would he say get the sniper rifle, and would he complain if the armory came back with a Chey-Tac M200? He might, but would he even know what the behemoth weapon is called and what the proper choice should be other than by how it should look? Link to post Share on other sites
-Drake- Posted May 23, 2011 Report Share Posted May 23, 2011 Did he ever even use the PPS =s ? Link to post Share on other sites
Jagdraben Posted May 23, 2011 Report Share Posted May 23, 2011 I do agree that a lot of thought goes into the selection of the weapon, but I don't think it has to do with the brand or model number (the people using them may have no clue of what they are, despite the logo engraved on the thing), it has to do with appearance (present or perceived) or marketing (sometimes). I also like the fact that you select example weapons that are all built around the characters or where a specific weapon is written into the plot line, and those examples are certainly not the standard. I'd like to hear examples of the opposite being the case. I certainly cannot think of any. If an average director had a script that called for a big city SWAT sniper to shoot something, would he say fetch the M700, or would he say get the sniper rifle, and would he complain if the armory came back with a Chey-Tac M200? He might, but would he even know what the behemoth weapon is called and what the proper choice should be (by name or even perhaps a potential brand)? It would be rather unusual for a director to make a seat-of-the-pants decision to suddenly introduce a character and a weapon in the middle of production. It might even torque the producers the wrong way. In any case, the director may not know, but that's why the producers pay for people whose job it is to make sure that it's the right gun in the right hands in the right scene... and that the gun is unloaded, loaded with blanks, or not even a gun. Did he ever even use the PPS =s ? http://www.tactical-life.com/online/wp-content/uploads/2008/03/walther1.jpg Not to the best of my knowledge. But it was introduced rather recently and there have only been a couple of Bond films made since it came into existence. Link to post Share on other sites
frogfish Posted May 23, 2011 Report Share Posted May 23, 2011 I'd like to hear examples of the opposite being the case. I certainly cannot think of any. Are you serious, you want examples where the wrong weapon was selected for a character/unit? You must not watch a lot of movies, I've got one on the top of my head right now and I'm sure I could find many many more. Megashark vs. Crocosaurus, Urkle's character referes to his G36K as an M16, repeatedly. Not every movie has consultants, and not every movie that does has good consultants. Heck, I remember Prison Break was filming onboard the training ship at my university, I was talking with the guys who were managing the weapons the director called for a SWAT/assault team to have SR25s (by name) with silencers to clear a ship. The armory guy gave the actors MP5SDs and pistols and for the rest of the time I was there (until they were packing up) nothing was said about it. Even still you think the average movie goer is going to know enough to realize what the difference is between these pistols (AK and AR sure, if not then they need to get out more)? Everything done in movies is about appearance, either a present appearance (an AK is an AK) or a perceived appearance (a terrorist/communist/general bad guy with a block 2 M4 would not look right to the average moviegoer, if the reason is not explained somehow. A bad guy needs a beat up AK to be a bad guy, generally). Link to post Share on other sites
spetsnazdave87 Posted May 23, 2011 Report Share Posted May 23, 2011 On IMFDB there's a custom prop chopped-down AK that's been in about a hundred films, from Rambo 4 to SWAT and allsorts- very unique looking rifle. They do re-use guns occasionally but agreed with Jag, for an iconic character a weapon is part of the 'look'. It's not the same but in the novel I'm writing for my MA the lead character has a Remington SP-10; completely impractical weapon from a real-world perspective (and it doesn't work too well for him in the book) but I read it was a 'sporting piece' based on a weapon originally designed to stop speeding cars and thought that was so awesome I had to put it in Sometimes, it's just all about looking badass. Link to post Share on other sites
frogfish Posted May 23, 2011 Report Share Posted May 23, 2011 On IMFDB there's a custom prop chopped-down AK that's been in about a hundred films, from Rambo 4 to SWAT and allsorts- very unique looking rifle. They do re-use guns occasionally but agreed with Jag, for an iconic character a weapon is part of the 'look'. Still missing the point, the question is not if the character needs an iconic weapon, it's if the weapon is iconic because of the name (obviously some famous things are) or because it fits in a perceived appearance for the character, and if it's the latter is it because the weapon looks that way, or because movies goers know that exact model fits with that character. Certainly some weapons are iconic by name or association to the character, but in most cases a weapon is chosen because "bad guys have Russian guns", "badasses use AKs", or "that gun looks futuristic", not because an FN2000 is a weapon from the future, or all badasses use AKs, but because that is the perceived paradigm from the general movie going populace. Do you think that when Leonardo DiCaprio's character in Inception was given a PX4 it was because that is the weapon the director/script called for by name, or do you think the studio solicited a marketing deal, and/or went down a list of images of weapons that might fit with the character? Sure that list may be assembled by someone who knows but I highly doubt they get final say, and the ultimate decision is based on marketing or what "looks" right, and has no bearing on the actual real-world performance of the weapon. Sometimes, it's just all about looking badass. Exactly. Anyhow this is way off topic so I'm sorry for arguing with Jag! Jag, nothing personal, just different views I assume. Link to post Share on other sites
Danke Posted May 23, 2011 Report Share Posted May 23, 2011 For Bond; FN FNP-9/Pro-9, Vltor Fortis, or Boberg XR-9. Link to post Share on other sites
frogfish Posted May 23, 2011 Report Share Posted May 23, 2011 That Boberg XR-9 is neat looking almost like a min Steyr M9 Steyr M-9 Link to post Share on other sites
spetsnazdave87 Posted May 23, 2011 Report Share Posted May 23, 2011 Ooh that Steyr M-9 is shexay Link to post Share on other sites
Perch Posted May 23, 2011 Report Share Posted May 23, 2011 You want classy? Get it here: Despite it's Swiss made it's pretty expensive, looks a bit different to the common handgun and is superb. It's like a Swiss watch, something Bond would definately use. (and will be aviable by KWA soon) Link to post Share on other sites
Habakure Posted May 23, 2011 Report Share Posted May 23, 2011 Any weapon on set, is down to the armourer. When James Cameron wanted a an M41A pulse rifle for Aliens made, he specified certain things to the armourer (Simon Anderton, I might have got his surname wrong -simon anderton- , its late and my memory is kack these days) had to deliever the goods. He filmed many guns firing and showed it to Cameron, he basically said "that one". If a weapon isn't available for some reason or other, the director has final call on wether to wait, of just shoot with an alternative. Even if there is a guy on set who use to be SAS and he says "we would never use that or do that", the director has final call along with what the armourer can produce. Bond needs a new weapon, it would all depend on wether it was important in the script or if it was a plot device (For example; only mi6 use - insert weapon name - so this guy must work for them! Kill him. etc). I like the look of that new walther PPS, yum yum. Link to post Share on other sites
frogfish Posted May 23, 2011 Report Share Posted May 23, 2011 Ooh that Steyr M-9 is shexay I know right! it's just hard as hell to find accessories for them, otherwise I'd have one as they are dirt cheap right now $325-$450USD at gun shows. Link to post Share on other sites
Jagdraben Posted May 23, 2011 Report Share Posted May 23, 2011 Are you serious, you want examples where the wrong weapon was selected for a character/unit? You must not watch a lot of movies, I've got one on the top of my head right now and I'm sure I could find many many more. Megashark vs. Crocosaurus, Urkle's character referes to his G36K as an M16, repeatedly. It should say something that you've had to reach into a steaming pile of poo to find something in your effort to prove me wrong. Simply put, I watch a lot of movies. I just don't watch sh___y movies. Link to post Share on other sites
frogfish Posted May 23, 2011 Report Share Posted May 23, 2011 It should say something that you've had to reach into a steaming pile of poo to find something in your effort to prove me wrong. It just happened to be the last thing I watched, it was most certainly not my choice. It was more like a 'MST3Kish' anti-rapture party with a bunch of marine biologists. But you know there have been some good flicks that have had this happen, I'd have to go back and look but I'm pretty sure it was Dances With Wolves that used a weapon 20 years ahead of it's time, instead of the correct repeating rifle, simply because getting a Henry Repeating rifle (I think that's right) was too difficult. There are many others I've seen this in while watching, but it's not something I make permanent note of every time it happens. Link to post Share on other sites
Jagdraben Posted May 23, 2011 Report Share Posted May 23, 2011 Dances With Wolves used entirely correct period weaponry. The only things that are a bit of a stretch are the Sharps carbines being sent to a post in BF-Nowhere, Dakota Territory and Lt. Dunbar's London-variation Colt Navy revolver. The 1860 Henry rifle used by Dunbar was also correct, although it was in the wrong caliber (which is inevitable, given that .44 Henry RF hasn't been manufactured since WWI). And the Union troops at the beginning may have used mixed Enfields and Springfields, which wouldn't have been correct, as units were issued only one or the other, not both. That being said, it was quite common for many years for B-Westerns to use Winchester 1892s in movies set during the 1870s and 1873 model P SAA revolvers in movies set during the 1850s. The worst that I can recollect right off are the Springfield M1873 Trap-Doors used in the Star Trek Voyager episode "The Q and the Grey". (I'm much more forgiving of TV shows, as they rarely have the budget or the time to get things 100% right.) Link to post Share on other sites
Xaccers Posted May 23, 2011 Report Share Posted May 23, 2011 It's a movie stopping power is moot, so is ammo capacity, looks are key. Prime examples, car's exploding when shot, long range dead accurate hits from a 9mm, Desert Eagles the Agents carry, and of course: Rambo. Link to post Share on other sites
frogfish Posted May 23, 2011 Report Share Posted May 23, 2011 Dances With Wolves used entirely correct period weaponry. I haven't seen it in forever but I remember reading (dosen't mean it's right) somewhere they used a winchester 1893 instead of a Henry in one instance at least, and I know there are several cases where uniform pieces are incorrect as you stated. I know I'm not the only person in the world who noticies issues with weapons in movies, google shows that, I just don't remember them as it's not something I need to know in order to survive. Link to post Share on other sites
Jagdraben Posted May 23, 2011 Report Share Posted May 23, 2011 IMFDB is a treasure trove of information of that sort. Link to post Share on other sites
FireKnife Posted May 23, 2011 Report Share Posted May 23, 2011 and of course: Rambo. What because hitting a driver of a jeep with a .50 cal that is in the back doesn't blow him to pieces Personally i can just see Walther, like Aston Martin, Lotus, Omega, Rolex, Armani, BMW and Bollinger pestering the film director and producer to put their new toy in just so they can sell more of them. Many companies do as they know it is good product placement, something the Bond franchise had a hand in with the Aston Martin DB5 and one of the first examples of major film product placement. 'FireKnife' Link to post Share on other sites
spetsnazdave87 Posted May 23, 2011 Report Share Posted May 23, 2011 Bond films are ALL product placement Link to post Share on other sites
FireKnife Posted May 23, 2011 Report Share Posted May 23, 2011 Bond films are ALL product placement That and an easy way to launch an actress into the spotlight. Unless you starred in the Moore era, i feel sorry for those women 'FireKnife' Link to post Share on other sites
hitmanNo2 Posted May 23, 2011 Report Share Posted May 23, 2011 I just hope they put Bond in another Mondeo Link to post Share on other sites
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