wraithxt1 Posted January 30, 2009 Report Share Posted January 30, 2009 (edited) Okay guys, here's what I believe to be my problem! I assume this part SHOULD be making a full seal, its cracking in two locations. So how do I go about replacing this piece of ######? Its venting so hard the lube in my green gas is coating EVERYTHING in my gun and leaking out cracks! Edited January 30, 2009 by wraithxt1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Lupus78 Posted January 30, 2009 Author Report Share Posted January 30, 2009 (edited) So how do I go about replacing this piece of ######? This issue has been talked about a lot here. The part is the #122 that you can find mentioned here a lot. It's a common problem and even Airsoft Buddy sells the replacement o-ring as spare part pack. You can also try to swap it with the #83 o-ring that has 1/2" outer diameter and 5/16' inner diameter. That has been reported to work fine on most cases. Also make sure the bolt inner system is screwed tight and is aligned correctly. This might be the reason it shreds so fast, but I guess it's still a bit unclear why this o-ring shreds with some people so fast and why with some people it keeps on working just fine with minimal wear like it should (like in my gun). Edited January 30, 2009 by Lupus78 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Chris North Posted January 30, 2009 Report Share Posted January 30, 2009 (edited) That's part #122 (the piston head o-ring). A few people have had trouble with that. You cou8ld look through the last 15 pages but I doubt they'll tell you anything super-informative that I won't tell you now. Basically, you could buy a replacement from Airsoft Buddy for $5 a pack plus $5 shipping, and that is pretty much guaranteed to work for at least a little while. Some people (myself included, but not all) have had great success replacing the o-ring with a #83 one that should be available at your local hardware store or probably definitely available at Home Depot (if you can stomach the trip ). Otto has a fix for the o-ring shredding problem involving using a ball-peen hammer to widen to brass cylinder opening. I've not had a problem with mine shredding though as long as I keep the sliver slotted screw that secures the black tube to the bolt carrier tight, so you might want to see if that helps first (tightening the screw). Edit: Damn you for posting before me Lupus, damn you! Edited January 30, 2009 by Chris North Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Lupus78 Posted January 30, 2009 Author Report Share Posted January 30, 2009 Edit: Damn you for posting before me Lupus, damn you! Heh, pretty much the same conclusion on both. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
cocofr69 Posted January 30, 2009 Report Share Posted January 30, 2009 is there anywhere i could purchase the ~350fps valve kit.... i have the valve that makes my WE shoot at around 520fps. I cant really use it at any fields here so i want to be able to use it. you can order this part : http://airsoftbuddy.com/index_eproduct_vie...products_id=195 and disassemble your nozzle to change it. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
w0lfy Posted January 30, 2009 Report Share Posted January 30, 2009 Anyone used Abbey Predator Ultra Gas with this gun? I am not really sure if this is equivalent to Green Gas or stronger, but it's the most available in my country. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Guges Mk3 Posted January 30, 2009 Report Share Posted January 30, 2009 Okay guys, here's what I believe to be my problem! I assume this part SHOULD be making a full seal, its cracking in two locations. So how do I go about replacing this piece of ######? Its venting so hard the lube in my green gas is coating EVERYTHING in my gun and leaking out cracks! So sad...WE just cuts way to many corners. If you can extract the o-ring relatively intact bring it to a local O-ring Indutrial supply store and ask them to measure it and find you a replacement made with Viton...not the cheap urethane crud...that will be a considerable improvement and will make your GBBR more "reliable". In the US you can buy that part for .47 cents at Precision Associates in MN. As for the gas check it out on the German airsoft site: Which shows your Abbey gas as stuff that is weaker then Green. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
rottenotto Posted January 30, 2009 Report Share Posted January 30, 2009 Hi Wraith, Im heading to the dealership in 2 mins to get my car serviced so Ill hit you back later with more info. But DAMN! lol! Your 122 is shredola. Theres your issue. You defintely have 2 immediate issues - the large bolt at the very end of the bolt carrier came loose and the opening to the brass cylinder (towards the rear) is still sharp with burrs from the factory. The result is what you see there - a shredded #122. Everytime it returned into that sharp cylinder, all sloppy and misaligned from coming loose, it chunked the rubber washer. You need to polish up that opening with 2K wet and paper - debur it. (I even flared mine - more later) And blue locktite the main bolt down once you replace the #122. As mentioned, some seem happy with a store bought 0-ring. It will work. However I have a blindingly fast ROF and great kick with the stock washers. And have ZERO wear issues after doing the things mentioned above. 50+ mags on a new, stock #122 washer and the edgs are still sharp and NO wear at all. PS.... The cooldown damage you have is a vicious cycle - the more worn it got - the more cool down - the more cool down - the stiffer that rubber washer got - the stiffer it got, the easier it chunked - the more it chunked - the more cooldown - repeat repeat repeat Quote Link to post Share on other sites
rottenotto Posted January 30, 2009 Report Share Posted January 30, 2009 Guges Mk3 Viton isnt the ideal material - poor cold temp performance. These valves/bolts/vavlves assemblies get so cold they frost over. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
rottenotto Posted January 30, 2009 Report Share Posted January 30, 2009 Slide the plastic tube away from the brass nozzle, and down the silver op rod. Get it out of teh way. Grip the silver rod with needle nose pliers right whre the plastic spacer tube was - right against the brass nozzle *albatross* end. Simply unthread the nozzle. To open the nozzle, use the pointed ends of the claws on your same needle nose pliers. Fit the ends into the slots machined on the bottom of the nozzle. (You will see these large flat slots machined into it to grip) It will simply unsrew. Valve assembly/nozzle is now open. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
wraithxt1 Posted January 30, 2009 Report Share Posted January 30, 2009 Interesting. So I guess I'll head to home depot later today and snag myself a #83 O-Ring. Do I just ask where I can find a #83 O-ring? Will anyone know what I'm talking about? From my understanding I'll just slip the old one off, slip this one on and presto, working gas gun with no venting? Quote Link to post Share on other sites
rottenotto Posted January 30, 2009 Report Share Posted January 30, 2009 (edited) Interesting. So I guess I'll head to home depot later today and snag myself a #83 O-Ring. Do I just ask where I can find a #83 O-ring? Will anyone know what I'm talking about? From my understanding I'll just slip the old one off, slip this one on and presto, working gas gun with no venting? Wraith, I pm'd you with a ton of how to's. Read it twice. The main thing is to get bolt #36 locked down and to have tube #38 and valvehead, perfectly centered in the bolt carrier. If this loosens and falls out of alignment the whole gun goes to *chaffinch* in a chain of events. When reassembling after replacing #122 (with whatever you want - its your party) be sure to degrease bolt #36 and tube #38 with lacquer thinner, naptha, prep sol, or whatever degreaser/cleaner you have got handy. The silicone all over these parts wont allow the Locktite to harden off, otherwise. Use blue Locktite and let the part set for a few hours before using it again - overnight if you can. Your back in biz. PS... My PM will give you the other 'cleanup mods' before you reassemble and to guarantee it never happens again. Edited January 30, 2009 by rottenotto Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Pollux77 Posted January 30, 2009 Report Share Posted January 30, 2009 Hey RottenOtto, I know the americans just *love* ye olde imperial system, but us krauts here in germay - we seem to be to stubborn to accept its beauty I'd need the diameter of O-Ring #122 in cm or mm. I could figure out that 0.5" is 1,27cm, but is there a difference between " and ' or did you just misspell? Could it be 0,79 cm? Danke aus Deutschland, Pollux Quote Link to post Share on other sites
rottenotto Posted January 30, 2009 Report Share Posted January 30, 2009 (edited) Hey RottenOtto, I know the americans just *love* ye olde imperial system, but us krauts here in germay - we seem to be to stubborn to accept its beauty I'd need the diameter of O-Ring #122 in cm or mm. I could figure out that 0.5" is 1,27cm, but is there a difference between " and ' or did you just misspell? Could it be 0,79 cm? Danke aus Deutschland, Pollux Anything for a fellow german I can get you the metric outer diamter and inner diameter of #122. As for the typo, which post? Was it mine? I dont recall ever listing the dimensions in detail. I think you are referring to Lupus' post. Edited January 30, 2009 by rottenotto Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Pollux77 Posted January 30, 2009 Report Share Posted January 30, 2009 (edited) My Bad - Lupus was the poster of the diameter. But thank you anyway for answering my call for metric units! Edited January 30, 2009 by Pollux77 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Sale Posted January 30, 2009 Report Share Posted January 30, 2009 Hmm, now I've got a shredded #122 as well. I noticed the entire piston/nozzle assembly was loose within the bolt carrier, so it has definitely caused #122 to hit the blowback cylinder on the way forward. The piston head should definitely be redesigned. I think the Nine Ball Dyna piston head would make a great archetype. A larger front flange, ports to expand the O-ring and a beefy O-ring instead of a fragile "skirted" Y-ring. That's my wish list: A great seal but more durability. Another improvement would be some blue loctite on the flat-head screw #36 that secures the piston to the bolt carrier. Just make sure you don't get any of that agent on the O-ring #37. -Sale Quote Link to post Share on other sites
rottenotto Posted January 30, 2009 Report Share Posted January 30, 2009 (edited) ^ Hi Sale Absolutely on the Nine-ball/AEG style design. (The O-ring MUST be smaller, not "the same size as" the cylinder on the return for it to work at optimum. Just like an AEG piston head seal. WE used an expanding face seal as their design) I need to note that I have had ZERO wear issues after polishing and flaring the opening of the brass cylinder - and Locktiting #36 down as I posted on the previous pages. The edges of my new #122 seal are crisp with no wear after 50+ mags. YAY! Now we're talking. There is always room for improvement (I have photos to post this weekend of a new quad seal Im working on) However, I think part #122 got lots of flack (even from me) unnecesarily. Any seal would have shredded and chunked to some degree from the sharp edges of the brass tube and #36 loosening. #36 loosening and backing out--->causing #38 to lean and fall out of alignment with the cylinder--->causing the rubber seal to smack the edges of the tube on its way in----->causing chunking and shredding. Locktite. Done. Edited January 30, 2009 by rottenotto Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Pollux77 Posted January 30, 2009 Report Share Posted January 30, 2009 Hey Rottenotto - I've got one more question for you: That part you fixed with the Ball-Peen Hammer, is that part #111? This would be it: I was trying to correct those burrs myself, but I coult not remove part # 112 from #111... Quote Link to post Share on other sites
chris u'5 Posted January 30, 2009 Report Share Posted January 30, 2009 Real Lewis Machine & Tools stock fit rock solid on the WE Which LMT stock did you fit IBICO? Did you fit an LMT stock tube or was it just the LMT stock? Quote Link to post Share on other sites
rottenotto Posted January 30, 2009 Report Share Posted January 30, 2009 Hey Rottenotto - I've got one more question for you: That part you fixed with the Ball-Peen Hammer, is that part #111? This would be it: I was trying to correct those burrs myself, but I coult not remove part # 112 from #111... Hi Pollux Not that part. The sharp edges you show there are fine and I honestly feel dont make for any issues at all. The back of part #112 - the brass cylinder - I flared it slightly by doing the following. With the gun dismantled, I placed a small ball peen hammer on the open tube. I then tapped gently with another hammer to "flare it". This rolled the sharp edges outward slightly. Do you have to do this? No. But it guaratees that if bolt #36 loosens again - and the tube #38 and valve head assembly goes out of alignemnt - it wont chew the washer (#122) as it tries to re-enter the cylinder. No matter HOW out of alignment it is. "Funnel effect" FTW. Incidentally, I finished with fine grit wetsand paper to polish the opening to smooth glass. (This step might be enough for most people). WE cuts a sharp chamfered edge there, in an attempt to do the same "funneling thing" or guiding the re-entry smoothly, it just isnt enough. It is also quite sharp. You can see the machining lines which are abrasive on the washer. (Ill have metric measurements tonight when I get back in) Quote Link to post Share on other sites
McArthur Posted January 30, 2009 Report Share Posted January 30, 2009 A write up of common problems and the known fixes (Ie, some tutorials on how to fix common problems) would be a really good idea. Would save there being so many questions and arguing in this thread. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
LordElpus Posted January 30, 2009 Report Share Posted January 30, 2009 A write up of common problems and the known fixes (Ie, some tutorials on how to fix common problems) would be a really good idea. Would save there being so many questions and arguing in this thread. Doing so and starting a fresh thread (and locking this one) might be an idea as the useful information in this thread is very fragmented. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Pollux77 Posted January 30, 2009 Report Share Posted January 30, 2009 Okay, I got it. Mine seems alright so far, not perfect but quite smooth. I'm still trying to fix the problem with my clogging BBs, if I try to roll a BB through the barrel it gets stuck in the Hopup-Area. The picture is taken looking through part 112 into 111. The red arrow is some kind of burr in the black area surrounding the hopup, the green arrow is pointing to the hopup itself. Might the damaged part be 117? I tried to dismantle the thing but did not succeed. I removed 113-116, found 1 small ball bearing (108?) but cannot remove the pin holding the inner barrel to 111. How do I do that? And what is part 118 anyway? AB is selling that as the hopup rubber, but I think he swaapped it with 109. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
wraithxt1 Posted January 30, 2009 Report Share Posted January 30, 2009 I just purchased the following from Airsoft Buddy Roller Bearing for WE Gas Blow Back M4( Steel Bolt Catch for WE Gas Blow Back M4 Charging Handle for WE Gas Blow Back M4 Parts #122 for WE Gas Blow Back M4 Parts #42 for WE Gas Blow Back M4 With these parts I should be more than set as far as upgrades go. Part 42 is the 300 FPS nozzle so I can use my M4 at local fields. I may try to widen it a little so I can get closer to 400 FPS. Did I miss anything? Quote Link to post Share on other sites
rottenotto Posted January 30, 2009 Report Share Posted January 30, 2009 (edited) I just purchased the following from Airsoft Buddy Roller Bearing for WE Gas Blow Back M4( Steel Bolt Catch for WE Gas Blow Back M4 Charging Handle for WE Gas Blow Back M4 Parts #122 for WE Gas Blow Back M4 Parts #42 for WE Gas Blow Back M4 With these parts I should be more than set as far as upgrades go. Part 42 is the 300 FPS nozzle so I can use my M4 at local fields. I may try to widen it a little so I can get closer to 400 FPS. Did I miss anything? Get a couple power tune up kits (valve assemblies) And you will find that the hop works soooo much better with more power. Use .28g bb's and that the powerup valve and you will be sailing flat way past 150 feet.... Edited January 30, 2009 by rottenotto Quote Link to post Share on other sites
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