renegadecow Posted January 25, 2013 Report Share Posted January 25, 2013 I wanted to put this in my original China Lake thread but it seems to have been archived already. Copy pasted from vietnam-airsoft: "As many of you know, in the past year I was in agreement with an airsoft manufacturer to produce my China Lake grenade launcher. I was not at liberty to divulge their identity back then, but seeing how things have gone sour now I can point out that ARES has officially shafted me. Everything was going smoothly until they decided to violate our contract by demanding detailed internal pictures of a real steel 40mm China Lake grenade launcher (was never in our agreement) to get the full payment out of them after I've already submitted to them the complete 3D CAD files. What infuriates me is that I never asked for much at all (only 2k USD!) out good faith because I of all people wanted this to become a reality and wanted to help them out as best I can. I never intended to get a lot out of this, but instead I get cheated out of it. So now I have to contact a 2nd company quick and sell them complete rights to my designs so they can take ARES to court should they decided to continue and rip off my work." The good thing is I'm not nearly as angry as I thought I would be when I was thinking of this scenario theoretically last year. Must be from watching too much MLP. Link to post Share on other sites
Wild_XIII Posted January 25, 2013 Report Share Posted January 25, 2013 That is a seriously *suitcase* move on their part. I hope you get something worked out dude. That China Lake is a VERY nice bit of kit and you don't need a manufacturer ripping you off over it! Surely if they've breached the contract, you can sue them or take them to court over withholding your pay? Link to post Share on other sites
FireKnife Posted January 25, 2013 Report Share Posted January 25, 2013 Surely if they've breached the contract, you can sue them or take them to court over withholding your pay? Depends how the laws in the far east country that ARES are from goes. If it is anything like the copying laws of say China I wouldn't expect much out of them at all sadly. So sad to hear about this, will need to add ARES to my list of companies to not buy from, just after Starbucks. 'FireKnife' Link to post Share on other sites
Wild_XIII Posted January 25, 2013 Report Share Posted January 25, 2013 Fair enough, I don't really know an awful lot on these legal things so I wouldn't know! I would say don't buy any Ares products, but most airsofters don't anyway don't they? Link to post Share on other sites
renegadecow Posted January 25, 2013 Author Report Share Posted January 25, 2013 More of a hassle for me if I try and take them to court myself, which is why I'm more inclined to find another company to sell the deigns to and do the suing for me. What's especially sucky is that I only went with ARES (not that I like their products in particular) because they asked first. edit: Should have listened to you guys and pitched it to ICS/G&P or any brand that isn't ARES because they would have made a real *suitcasey* China Lake. Link to post Share on other sites
DarkLite Posted January 25, 2013 Report Share Posted January 25, 2013 :C *suitcase* mate, that sucks. Link to post Share on other sites
WillB Posted January 25, 2013 Report Share Posted January 25, 2013 Wow. Sorry to hear the Renegade. I judged your China Lake in the ASF build contest, it was defiantly something to behold! Keep up the good work on those designs. I know some people so if you ever need help getting in contact with companies let me know. Link to post Share on other sites
bankz5152 Posted January 25, 2013 Report Share Posted January 25, 2013 What absolutle w*nkers Link to post Share on other sites
Paul202 Posted January 25, 2013 Report Share Posted January 25, 2013 And there goes all my hypothetical future ARES purchases. Link to post Share on other sites
Horsem4n Posted January 25, 2013 Report Share Posted January 25, 2013 lol, you never had a real china lake to work with, where did they expect you to get the pictures from? Link to post Share on other sites
FTZ-WildeCard Posted January 25, 2013 Report Share Posted January 25, 2013 Ares, a sister company of Cybergun...? Terrible news. Hopefully you can find some way of getting what you deserve.. and soon! If they do decide to use your design, it won't take much to drum up some negative PR with regards to where the design really came from ... Link to post Share on other sites
faramon Posted January 25, 2013 Report Share Posted January 25, 2013 RC that is just pure bad to happen to you, I hope you manage to sort something out either way! Link to post Share on other sites
CatgutViolin Posted January 25, 2013 Report Share Posted January 25, 2013 Well, ARES can go to hell for all I'm concerned. I won't be buying their products. Link to post Share on other sites
FTZ-WildeCard Posted January 25, 2013 Report Share Posted January 25, 2013 I don't know about the inner workings of your design, but seeing as you haven't actually sold them yet - can't you apply for some kind of patent or other protection for your work? Link to post Share on other sites
Rob15 Posted January 25, 2013 Report Share Posted January 25, 2013 That really sucks, but I can't say I'm that suprised. Even if you sell the designs to another manufacturer will they have any grounds to sue Ares on? Unless you have a patent or other copyright protection on your design it'll just be considered an openly available design free for anyone to copy as they wish I'd have thought, getting a patent after having published build threads on public forums is likely to be pretty much impossible and Ares could well just try and file for it themselves, you only have to look at the case of Modify 'apparantly' filing for a patent on a copy of the Riot SC double sector gear to realise it's far from impossible. I'd say try and sell the designs to another manufacturer, take the money and then let them worry about producing it and taking sales away from Ares. Link to post Share on other sites
AceOfSkulls Posted January 25, 2013 Report Share Posted January 25, 2013 *rickroll* move Ares. I wont be buying anything Ares ever anyway. I hope you can work something out. Link to post Share on other sites
renegadecow Posted January 25, 2013 Author Report Share Posted January 25, 2013 That really sucks, but I can't say I'm that suprised. Actually, looking back, I shouldn't be surprised either if after all they've shown their colors earlier on in screwing over STAR. As much as it was me that was cheated, I can put blame on myself for having poor judgement in character. Link to post Share on other sites
Senden Posted January 25, 2013 Report Share Posted January 25, 2013 That really sucks, but I can't say I'm that suprised. Even if you sell the designs to another manufacturer will they have any grounds to sue Ares on? Unless you have a patent or other copyright protection on your design it'll just be considered an openly available design free for anyone to copy as they wish I'd have thought, getting a patent after having published build threads on public forums is likely to be pretty much impossible and Ares could well just try and file for it themselves, you only have to look at the case of Modify 'apparantly' filing for a patent on a copy of the Riot SC double sector gear to realise it's far from impossible. I'd say try and sell the designs to another manufacturer, take the money and then let them worry about producing it and taking sales away from Ares. Not necessarily. However since the china lake launcher is essentially an 40mm slide-action repeater, there is insufficient novelty to file a patent on anything except as 'A device for the loading and discharging to two or more of AIRSOFT cartridges (also known as MOSCARTS, 40mm grenades, etc) by a slide action mechanism, in the style of a slide action firearm, but not being a firearm itself.' If you placed it for sale before they go to market you could also make a claim based on Trade Dress infringement, (Glock do this all the time, its why no the springfield xDm has extraneous bevels and features, Glock has registered a squared off slide WITHOUT and bevels or steps, and have won in court against other manufacturers) but only if you were selling to the same market. Link to post Share on other sites
amateurstuntman Posted January 25, 2013 Report Share Posted January 25, 2013 I don't know how but I missed this entire build. I saw this thread. I thought "no surprise, ARES are a bunch of asshats". I searched for the build thread. I found it. I followed the link to the youtube video of you firing it - awesome, you have some elite skills my friend. (this is where I made my mistake) I read some of the comments. Whatever respect I had for my fellow humans is gone, I wish nothing but death to them all. If anyone on here is a supervillan with some sort of doomsday plan then I will gladly sign up for an entry level henching job. Let me know. Link to post Share on other sites
hitmanNo2 Posted January 25, 2013 Report Share Posted January 25, 2013 Ah, rule # 17 of the Internet. Do not venture into YouTube comments. Any hilarious material will be capped and posted on Reddit/Imgur e.t.c. Link to post Share on other sites
bankz5152 Posted January 25, 2013 Report Share Posted January 25, 2013 Whatever respect I had for my fellow humans is gone, I wish nothing but death to them all. If anyone on here is a supervillan with some sort of doomsday plan then I will gladly sign up for an entry level henching job. Let me know. Welcome to reality. Link to post Share on other sites
SHWEL Posted January 25, 2013 Report Share Posted January 25, 2013 Sorry to see this happen. I thought it would happen, but without your involvement at all. As a Community, we should make sure the product is a market failure... But RC might just like his design on shelves.. What a terrible spot to be in. Link to post Share on other sites
Horsem4n Posted January 25, 2013 Report Share Posted January 25, 2013 for all you know, ares may have already filed for the patent. if ares does release it, we will have to set up a boycott. Link to post Share on other sites
sandstorm Posted January 25, 2013 Report Share Posted January 25, 2013 Just let BATF know that ARES is extremely interested in US military hardware grade destructive devices. Let the bastards work for us for a change... Link to post Share on other sites
PureSilver Posted January 25, 2013 Report Share Posted January 25, 2013 I followed the link to the youtube video of you firing it - awesome, you have some elite skills my friend. (this is where I made my mistake) I read some of the comments. Link to post Share on other sites
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